Some really sensible points by @Fozzy ✅

I don't want solar farms taking over good agricultural land. The French have a good idea, putting solar panels over car parks

Good to agree on fracking, it's the chemicals that cause the fracking of most concern, especially when seeping into ground water.

I'm uneasy too re £40bn annually. If it's required, it needs to be structured so as a % gov't shareholder,  the State can then claw the money back in future years.

Sorry @Fozzy but Heat Pumps? 

Homeowners must have the choice of heating system for their home whether it be Solid fuel central heating, gas central heating, gas wall heaters, or the maligned heat pump if they want it.

The heat pump is definitely not a sensible choice to heat a home. Without the massive subsidies by the government, heat pumps would only be affordable for a small number of householders. 

Financial green incentives such as grants to install heat pumps should be scrapped, as well as tax incentives for companies building wind farms & solar panels that blight the landscape of the UK.

The 8% green levy on energy bills should be scrapped as well as the standing charge.The 5% VAT on domestic energy bills should be scrapped too.

1 hour ago, Piethagoram said:

Some really sensible points by @Fozzy ✅

The school teacher has marked your work Fozzy, & the school teacher is always right isn't he. 

2 hours ago, Robbie said:

Sorry @Fozzy but Heat Pumps? 

Homeowners must have the choice of heating system for their home whether it be Solid fuel central heating, gas central heating, gas wall heaters, or the maligned heat pump if they want it.

I think you misread my post @Robbie, I said in houses being built, new builds, not existing properties (although you could argue that Council’s and Housing Association’s should be the first to have to install them). Homebuyers will then obviously have these heat sources incorporated into the cost of buying the home, same as it is solar panels.

Personally, I don’t know that much about them, but they can be cheaper to run than a gas boiler (depends on electric price) but cost an absolute fortune and are a fair size. I have no idea where I could possibly fit one on my property anyway, I have a full length conservatory on the back and narrow driveway to the side.

Forgot to add, I’m all for cancelling any subsidy that Dale Vince gets, at least until he puts proper Cornish pasties and Sausage rolls on the menu at FGR! ????

1 hour ago, Fozzy said:

I think you misread my post @Robbie, I said in houses being built, new builds, not existing properties (although you could argue that Council’s and Housing Association’s should be the first to have to install them). Homebuyers will then obviously have these heat sources incorporated into the cost of buying the home, same as it is solar panels.

Personally, I don’t know that much about them, but they can be cheaper to run than a gas boiler (depends on electric price) but cost an absolute fortune and are a fair size. I have no idea where I could possibly fit one on my property anyway, I have a full length conservatory on the back and narrow driveway to the side.

Forgot to add, I’m all for cancelling any subsidy that Dale Vince gets, at least until he puts proper Cornish pasties and Sausage rolls on the menu at FGR! ????

I didn't misread your post. Unfortunately, putting heat pumps in new builds is a way of increasing that type of heating by stealth.

This will continue unabated unfortunately. Both Tory & Labour are determined to race each other to Net Zero. 

8 hours ago, Robbie said:

I didn't misread your post. Unfortunately, putting heat pumps in new builds is a way of increasing that type of heating by stealth.

This will continue unabated unfortunately. Both Tory & Labour are determined to race each other to Net Zero. 

Not by stealth, by law. From 2025 new builds must have an alternative heat source as they will no longer be allowed to install gas boilers.

Unless you are thinking of buying a new build, it won’t affect you.

I would never buy a new build if anyway as they’re thrown up nowadays by poor corporate building firms only interested in maximising profits. The heat source is the least of your worries, poor build quality and drainage issues are enough to give you nightmares 

 

19 hours ago, Robbie said:

should be scrapped, as well as tax incentives for companies building wind farms & solar panels that blight the landscape of the UK.

Blight the landscape....if it means cheaper electricity then so be it. UK needs to lower its electricity costs

"The 5% VAT on domestic energy bills should be scrapped too."

So @Robbiehow do you propose then to plug the funding gap. Would raising VAT on utility bills to say 10%, to allow reinstatement of winter fuel payments be acceptable?

7 hours ago, Fozzy said:

Not by stealth, by law. From 2025 new builds must have an alternative heat source as they will no longer be allowed to install gas boilers.

 

Do you agree with a law that bans a perfectly good heat source for homeowners?

It's a ludicrous law, but it is allowing the introduction of heat pumps to slowly increase them by stealth.New builds become old builds eventually 

@Piethagoram. You obviously didn't read my post. NO VAT on domestic energy bills.

STOP all government funding of green energy projects. STOP all green Government incentives. STOP all green Government subsidies.

Stop overseas aid. For example, Stop giving China, India & Syria aid.

That will more than pay for the £1.4 needed to help pensioners & help WASPI women too.

3 minutes ago, Robbie said:

Do you agree with a law that bans a perfectly good heat source for homeowners?

If it was for existing homes, no. For new builds? Absolutely, should have been done years ago.

16 minutes ago, Robbie said:

Do you agree with a law that bans a perfectly good heat source for homeowners?

It's a ludicrous law, but it is allowing the introduction of heat pumps to slowly increase them by stealth.New builds become old builds eventually 

@Piethagoram. You obviously didn't read my post. NO VAT on domestic energy bills.

STOP all government funding of green energy projects. STOP all green Government incentives. STOP all green Government subsidies.

Stop overseas aid. For example, Stop giving China, India & Syria aid.

That will more than pay for the £1.4 needed to help pensioners & help WASPI women too.

I did read your post @Robbie

So basically what you are saying that you will be happy with power cuts in the not too distant future. We don't have enough North Sea gas to generate the electricity needed now. We would rely on LNG imports...energy security in these "cold war" type int'l political scenarios, you would be putting the UK at risk

Coal, there are hardly any open cast coal mines viable in the UK, so we would have to import coal! 

Food security, energy security..the latter best achieved with wind farms on shore and off shore.

32 minutes ago, Piethagoram said:

I did read your post @Robbie

So basically what you are saying that you will be happy with power cuts in the not too distant future. We don't have enough North Sea gas to generate the electricity needed now. We would rely on LNG imports...energy security in these "cold war" type int'l political scenarios, you would be putting the UK at risk

Coal, there are hardly any open cast coal mines viable in the UK, so we would have to import coal! 

Food security, energy security..the latter best achieved with wind farms on shore and off shore.

You always try to be smart don't you Mr P. Always the smart one, always right, never wrong, knows what is best for the Country, always putting words in people's mouths when you are losing the argument.@Wheelbarrow repair man was right about that.

There's plenty of gas under our feet right now but you don't want to tap into it.Theres more oil fields in the north sea to be extracted and where's there is oil there is gas.

Labour are compromising our security by turning to green energy.

And you say you don't agree with Labour stopping the winter fuel allowance.

So let's see you condemn Labour and push for them on social media to reverse it, Let's see you condemn Labour for lying to the WASPI women, & push for Labour  to reverse it but you won't will you.

 

5 minutes ago, Robbie said:

So let's see you condemn Labour and push for them on social media to reverse it

Sorry @Robbie you must have overlooked it:

You must concentrate more dear @Robbie I'm not afraid of calling bad policies out, whichever party it is

Let's try to continue debating, without causing any upset please.

3 hours ago, Robbie said:

STOP all government funding of green energy projects. STOP all green Government incentives. STOP all green Government subsidies.

I agree to a point, but investing in solar energy does seem to be a good idea. I have solar power on my roof, it was installed by a government scheme and has made a huge difference to my home. We produce far more electricity for the national grid, which somewhat annoys me due to that energy being sold on for a premium price - whilst the energy costs are still stupidly high. We do get a low percentage paid for providing this, but I would feel happier knowing I wasn't helping to screw my neighbours over.

There's room for green energy, but we seem to be trying to put our hands in every type of pot and every scheme possible.

When our boiler needed replacing, we had issues convincing British Gas that we didn't want a heating pump installed.

This decision was largely due to the noise produced by them, the costs involved in changing our system and the excessive price. Some houses might suit having this installed, but not mine.

In 10 years time, heat pumps might be a lot better. There might be models which are now, but I am not convinced by any of the ones British Gas showed us. I don't want what sounds like an aeroplane flying over constantly in my back garden. In the early 00s, it wasn't uncommon to hear every flight making its way overhead. It's rare you hear them now.

 

2 hours ago, Piethagoram said:

 

No need for Labour to worry, mother Earth will deal with it's climate in its own way as it has always done since it's formation. 

4 hours ago, Robbie said:

mother Earth will deal with it's climate in its own way as it has always done since it's formation

and there lies the problem, the top scientists in the world are raising concerns of the polar ice caps melting (factual) against fossil fuel propogandists shouting loudly on behalf of the fossil fuel industry.

Nature's way of dealing with it, is the global rise in world temperatures. It's that simple and such temperature rises are unacceptable and action needs to be taken

5 hours ago, Robbie said:

No need for Labour to worry, mother Earth will deal with it's climate in its own way as it has always done since it's formation. 

Only way that Mother Earth will deal with it is to destroy mankind. She’s already started.

On 19/12/2024 at 09:47, Robbie said:

You always try to be smart don't you Mr P. Always the smart one, always right, never wrong, knows what is best for the Country, always putting words in people's mouths when you are losing the argument.

@RobbieI have worked in the North Sea Oil and Gas Exploration industry. I've even been part of the team that launched oil and gas rigs. What are your qualifications to comment, apart from retweeting right wing fossil fuel backed accounts?

14 hours ago, Piethagoram said:

@RobbieI have worked in the North Sea Oil and Gas Exploration industry. I've even been part of the team that launched oil and gas rigs. What are your qualifications to comment, apart from retweeting right wing fossil fuel backed accounts?

So somebody who worked in the fossil fuel industry, who once believed in it, is now saying that they don't believe in it. Is that right. Or did you ever believe in it in the first place.

So lots of North sea Oil & Gas workers, former colleagues of yours, are set to lose their jobs, but it seems you are ok with that. Is that right?

Personally, I couldn't have worked in an industry that I didn't believe in. But that's just me. 

As for global warming, I think I would rather believe learned scientists that have made an compelling case against global warming thanks.

And in the interest of balance, it's good that people can see an alternative opinion and to make up their own minds about whether global warming is fact or fiction.

Oh dear. More Net Zero misery for Households.

 

On 21/12/2024 at 06:52, Robbie said:

As for global warming, I think I would rather believe learned scientists that have made an compelling case against global warming thanks.

I agree @Robbie we should definitely listen to scientists rather than, newspapers, politicians or random folk on X and the like but there are also lots of learned scientists who say that global warming is very real and a danger to the world, so my question is how do we decide which scientists are right?

@Fan of Big Tone It could be an idea for all these scientists on each side of the fence to get together, or at least a good number of them, & agree on the best way forward & come to a common consensus.

Something that's never discussed, there must be scientists in China, India & Indonesia that have views on their Countries burning all this fossil fuel regardless of the concerns of those Countries who want to reduce it.

What happens when Countries in Africa have their industrial revolution? 

You can bet your bottom dollar that they'll use cheap fossil fuel to drive that revolution.

That's why there has to be less arguing & more consensus.

27 minutes ago, Robbie said:

@Fan of Big Tone It could be an idea for all these scientists on each side of the fence to get together, or at least a good number of them, & agree on the best way forward & come to a common consensus.

I doubt that will happen both sides of the argument are probably confident that their theory is the correct one and won’t listen to counter arguments, both sides think they are right.

A bit like you and @Piethagoram really. 

No offence only joking. 

On 21/12/2024 at 21:34, Robbie said:

Oh dear. More Net Zero misery for Households.

 

What The Telegraph fails to point out ( I wonder why), would be an offset  in the significant cost of reduction in Council Tax ( on the costs of recycling)

So effectively consumers benefit with a lower council tax.... then we just concentrate on why food costs are higher with Brexit

On 03/01/2025 at 05:55, Piethagoram said:

What The Telegraph fails to point out ( I wonder why), would be an offset  in the significant cost of reduction in Council Tax ( on the costs of recycling)

So effectively consumers benefit with a lower council tax.... then we just concentrate on why food costs are higher with Brexit

Oh come on now, even you can't believe that spin! ????????????